00:00:00 Chris
Hello and welcome to this Week’s Omni Talk Retail Fast Five, brought to you by the Omni Talk retail podcast network. First off, happy Veterans Day to anyone who has served in our arms services, especially to my wife who is in the Air Force. Thank you to her and to all of you that have served. And second, this is the week the holidays officially kicked into high gear. Amazon wants you to shop by text message. DoorDash wants you to shop its Black Friday deals and Disney turned TikTok into a holiday mall. Oh, and third, just for good measure, CVS is splitting itself into two. Two tell me. Break it all down. This week I welcome quite the dynamic duo, Patagonio’s former VP of digital, Angela Clark and the former chief merchant of Petco and 7 11, Jack Stout producer Ella. Let’s get to today’s show because this is the Omnitoc Retail Fast Five.
00:00:56 Jack
You’re going to be the mall in your pocket, right? You to have mall like deals.
00:01:01 Chris
It is the foundational technology for Omni Channel retailing.
00:01:06 Angela
Well, if you’re doing deep searching and research, comparison shop is going to be very clunky.
00:01:11 Jack
They’re the one retailer to try and do this independently.
00:01:15 Chris
I mean when you have that many banners that have existed for so long, you can only imagine the complication of this effort.
00:01:21 Angela
Could be a career breaker or a career maker.
00:01:25 Jack
Retail is a distribution business.
00:01:27 Chris
That was so much fun. Wow, two Fast five newbies today, but two with quite the operational pedigree, I might add. Angela Clark, how are you this morning?
00:01:39 Angela
I’m great, how are you?
00:01:41 Chris
I’m good, I’m good. What time is it where you are right now?
00:01:43 Angela
It is 7:35am So.
00:01:47 Chris
7:35Am up bright and early in the morning. You are on the zoom early for this too. So thank you for joining us. Tell our audience about yourself. I’ve known you for probably two or three years now. We’ve.
00:01:57 Angela
Yeah,.
00:01:57 Chris
We’ve crossed paths in the conference circuit. Yeah. Tell the audience about you, about who you are.
00:02:01 Angela
Angela Clark, I’m based in Los Angeles, originally from Michigan, a proud detroiter, lived in LA and California probably for about 25 years. But my career has really been about digital strategy, business strategy, mainly for a lot of well known brands I’ve been very excited about. So Patagonia, as you mentioned, ebay, Levi, back in the day, Smith and Hawkins and oh.
00:02:27 Chris
My God,.
00:02:28 Angela
Yeah, I.
00:02:29 Chris
Didn’t know the Smith and I can even.
00:02:30 Angela
Go further back but I don’t want to.
00:02:32 Chris
Give.
00:02:32 Angela
Away my age but a lot of My experience, I started as a merchant, started on the sales floor, honestly in college, but I’ve always been in retail and digital has been my, my saving grace in my career for the last 12 years or so. Fully dedicated to digital and direct to consumer.
00:02:50 Chris
Yeah, you are steeped in digital, my friend. Which is why, which is why I chose today’s headline specifically because I knew you were going to be odd, especially the lead headline, which I can’t wait to get to. All right, and Jack Stout, former Chief Merchant at 7:11 and most recently at Petco as well. Jack, how is life down in Texas for you?
00:03:08 Jack
I got to be honest, it’s going great. The weather this time of year in Texas is amazing. And I’m happy to join you this, you know, on Veterans Day. Appreciate the shout out. Like your wife, I spent a little time in the Air Force back in the day.
00:03:22 Chris
Oh, did you? Which, which base were you at, Jack?
00:03:26 Jack
Primarily Wright Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio and intelligence community. Doing a lot of math.
00:03:32 Chris
Okay. Oh, got it, got it. I know she’s listening to this right now and appreciates that, that little call out and that salute too. So. Well, give everyone the 411 on you too, Jack.
00:03:41 Jack
Oh, yeah. So I spent a little over 20 years at 7:11, including five years as their chief merchant, a variety of other roles. I’m kind of a retailer with a broad base of experience, but the last, you know, kind of half of that career all focused in merchandising. Really loved it. One highlight was spending almost a year in Japan working with 711 Japan, learning about their merchandising processes.
00:04:07 Chris
Oh, wow.
00:04:07 Jack
Great experience. And you know, after I left 711 took a beat, but then spent about 18 months at Petco as their chief merchant during their recent leadership transformation. And I’m, you know, kind of currently contemplating my next move while I catch up on some, you know, you know, long awaited travel and trying to rekindle my golf game too.
00:04:30 Chris
Yeah, right, right, right. And I. And you told me you’re writing a book as well, right, Jack, are you thinking about.
00:04:34 Jack
It? Early stage project and we’ll see if we actually get it across the finish line. But yeah, I’m a kind of amateur hobbyist in, in the mixology world and looking at writing a book on a kind of compendium of the gin martini.
00:04:50 Chris
The gin martini, yes, yes. Omnitok fans, that’s what you’re getting here. You’re getting experts on retail and also the making of gin martini. So. Well, thank you both for joining me. I’m really excited about today’s show because you know I pride we pride ourselves here at Omni Talk of get on getting real operators with experience talking about the headlines and you two clearly fit the bill. So let’s get to this week’s Fast Five, which is brought to you of course with the help and support of the A&M consumer and retail group Mirakl, Quorso, Ocampo Capital, Manhattan and Smart Scout.
In this week’s Fast Five, we’ve got news on CVS splitting off its retail pharmacy business into a standalone public company Aho Delez USA overhauling its POS systems. Disney bringing 20 plus brands together for its first ever TikTok shop super brand Day. Don’t ask me to say that again, although I probably will have to later in the show and doordash getting aggressive as a bona fide holiday retailer. But we begin today with Amazon which wants you to shop by text. Headline number one is of course brought to you with the help and support of the A&M Consumer and Retail Group. The A&M Consumer and Retail Group is a management consulting firm that tackles the most complex challenges and advances its clients, people and communities toward their maximum potential. CRG brings the experience, tools and operator like pragmatism to help retailers and consumer products companies be on the right side of disruption. Okay, here we go. Angela Amazon’s Alexa for Shopping is now just a text away.
Customers can text an AI shopping agent that searches, compares, adds items to the cart and completes the purchase for them, according to an Amazon blog post. Texting launched November 6th for a small invite only group of US customers and Amazon plans to expand it to millions more in the coming weeks. Shoppers link their phone number and text the contact saved as Alexa Shopping. The agent searches, compares, makes suggestions, buys when the shop is ready and send delivery updates. Conversations carry over between texts, the Amazon shopping app, Amazon.com and all Alexa devices, said Rajiv Mehta, VP of conversational shopping at Amazon. Yes, that’s a real title. Quote now with Alexa for Shopping, your personal shopping agent is just a text away. End quote. Angela Amazon is betting that the most used app on everyone’s phone, texting is the right home for agent E commerce. Will text be the killer interface for AI shopping agents that Amazon hopes or possibly thinks that it could be?
00:07:22 Angela
Yeah, so I think, I actually think this is a really good play for Amazon. You know, text is a very natural place for this type of agents. It really actually isn’t a new idea. There’s been providers offering this type of service for white label for retailers for years, especially when you think about CX support or customer service support. But the difference here is what type of shopping is it for? And I think for Amazon it sort of makes sense. Like you have your perpetual shopping cart. I’m an avid Amazon user, so I’m bringing my personal experience of one into this conversation. But you’re talking about commodities, things that you need to buy frequently. I think all of that’s really strong. Plus they’ve got, you know, they’ve got trust from a brand perspective. They have your zero party data already built in. So experience is going to be solid. But what I think is going to get clunky is if you’re doing deep searching or research, comparison shop is going to be very clunky being able to scale that beyond the Alexa user.
They have 400 million users currently, so that’s a lot of people that will probably naturally transition to that. But I think kind of getting past those people or that that person who’s already using that might be a little challenging. You know, some of the statistics, Sorry, some of the statistics say that about 30% of shoppers don’t trust, you know, an agent actually finishing their shopping experience. So seeing that across the board, I think is it. And will it kill Muse and Gemini? Probably not. Meta’s, you know, really been smart about who they’ve aligned Muse with. They’ve aligned with Walmart, Gap, Sephora, you know, Wayfair, Best Buy. Those are huge brands. And then when you look at the Gemini side, they started building that with partners like Sephora, Etsy, Walmart, et cetera and even payment types like American Express and Visa. So I think that they’re going to have a much broader reach. They’re looking at a completely different user experience. I think it’s going to be great for them. But Amazon’s always swimming in their own lanes from my perspective.
00:09:20 Chris
Yeah. So you like this? You like this? You think it’s a good move from Amazon? Yeah,.
00:09:24 Angela
I do.
00:09:24 Chris
Yeah. I did you. I think the interesting thing about it is the actual naming of the text thread too. I think that’s a really interesting idea. It’s funny too, as you were saying that like, you know, how willing are consumers to use agent E Commerce. But I think I was talking about this with my mom, believe it or not, yesterday I was.
00:09:38 Angela
Saying,.
00:09:39 Chris
You know, back in the day, none of us were comfortable giving our credit card to a website, you know, and look at us now, right? We’re giving it faster than we can even push a button. But my question, my follow up Question for you, Angela too, before I want to get Jack’s opinion, here is the idea of text versus like an app or a browser interface for LLM shopping. Like how much do you think that takes hold? And if you had to put your prediction hat on, where do you think it will end up?
00:10:03 Angela
I think there’s a place for, you know, like I said, I’ve actually explored this technology as a business partner, but I think on a smaller brand it didn’t really play out that well.
00:10:14 Chris
Right.
00:10:15 Angela
But I think for that younger shopper, think Gen Z, you know, was it Gen Alpha? They live on text. And I think if the interface is seamless, the notifications, I think, you know, a lot of airlines are sort of using this type of thing. I think it absolutely could work.
00:10:33 Chris
Yeah, that’s what I think too. Like, I think of like, you know, if, if you have those super loyal shoppers and particularly you have an assortment that is geared towards, you know, repeat purchases. So I think Amazon, Walmart, Target, grocery stores. I think this is partly why I’ve been intuitively saying, like, you’ve got to get this working on your own site and through your own property so that you can expand into here and create some defensive moats against the LLMs which are going to be browser based or app based that are going to potentially siphon some of that off, but that at least keeps your core customer engaged with you very through the app that is the most used app on everyone’s mobile phone. But Jack, what do you think here?
00:11:09 Jack
Well, I think this is really a play to drive a frictionless experience. Right. For those that choose the channel of texting. Right. Text makes it really easy to multitask. I mean, you’re on your text messages with friends, with colleagues, whoever, and importantly on the go and voice texting. Right. So if you’re driving in your car and you want to, oh, I forgot to order something.
00:11:34 Chris
Right.
00:11:35 Jack
This is a great way to, to have that interface and trying to switch apps while you’re on the go is not quite as frictionless. But I do think the experience will vary by the user and I think this play is really about that give the user the shopping experience they want. And this is just one more way to tailor the shopping experience to the user. I do think, as Angela said, the integration across this with app and how seamless those transitions are, if you want to switch to a more detailed product comparison, you’re probably going to want to go into the app and that needs to be seamless. I’m sure Amazon will put the resources against that. And then, and lastly, I’d say the most interesting thing to me is, you know, Amazon’s going a little bit different direction here than say, you know, Walmart, who has integrated with Siri a little bit and other digital partners. Amazon’s really trying to keep control of the data and I think importantly, really full stop, the ad revenue associated with that.
00:12:40 Chris
Yeah, yeah, I think that’s the play. I think that’s the key point here, right, Jack, is like this feels like, and I think, Angela, you would agree with this too. This feels like a strong defensive play for Amazon to keep the first product search relevance that it, that it has always garnered by people visiting its own properties. And then yes, of course, the Google sphere out there, you know that and, and the LLM sphere that’s going to take up the other residual portion of that. But keeping core of the first product search traffic that is going to Amazon. This is a smart move for them. Do you agree, Jack? It seems like you’re shaking your head.
00:13:15 Jack
Absolutely. Like I say, they’re the one retailer that has the size, customer base and the product assortment, breadth and the digital resources to try and do this independently. And I think everybody else is going to be dependent upon other players.
00:13:31 Chris
Angelo, last word. What do you think here?
00:13:33 Angela
I think, you know, what Jack said is absolutely right. They’ve put in a signal that their defensive plays, they don’t want muse, they blocked all these other agents because they want to control that lane themselves.
00:13:43 Chris
Right. 100%. So I think net, net, we like this move from Amazon. It seems like it’s very smart, at least, at least on the surface right now, today, if you ask me. Today. All right, headline number two. Headline number two is brought to you by Miracle, the catalyst of Commerce. Over 450 retailers are opening new revenue streams with marketplaces, dropship and retail media. And succeeding with Miracle, you can unlock more products, more partners and more profits without the heavy lifting. So what’s holding you back, everybody? Visit miracle.com to learn more. Headline number two. CVS plans to split into two independent public companies spinning off its roughly 9,000 store retail pharmacy business as CVS Pharmacy. According to Chain Storage. The new CVS Pharmacy would include the drugstores, mail order pharmacy operations in store minute clinics and Health 100. The Health Tech Services subsidiary CVS launched earlier this year. The remaining company, Aetna Caremark and the health care and specialty drug businesses keeps the CVS Health name and will be led by current chairman and CEO David Joyner. Group president Prem Shah will be CEO of CVS Pharmacy. The split is expected to be completed in the first half of 2028. Jack, you get the lucky roll of the dice today, my friend. You get the ADM put you on the spot. Question of the week, and here it is. What do you think is the relative appeal of CVS Pharmacy after this intended separation? And how do you anticipate the move reshaping the role of neighborhood pharmacies in healthcare?
00:15:14 Jack
Big question here. And, you know, this, this move, I know management is trying to spin it as, you know, enabling focus on two distinct businesses, but this really feels more like a proactive move to avoid more regulatory scrutiny to me personally, and that this.
00:15:32 Chris
100,.
00:15:33 Jack
This is going to kind of hurt the, a little bit of the moat they built around their retail business. It’s allowed them to. To really position themselves a little bit differently than their competitors. Where I think this is go. Where I think this has to go after this, though, is a really more focus on, you know, their minute clinics and the health care services that they’ve offered, because that’s the other moat they’ve tried to build. Right? And the minute clinics are going to stay with CVS Pharmacy, not move over to CVS Health. And more and more, all retailers are trying to find reasons that are not just products to drive you into the store. And health care services is one way to do that. You see the rise of all these, you know, kind of what we call it, doc in a box or urgent care clinics. You know, over the last 10 or 12 years, the number of those clinics in the US has like doubled. And, you know, and CVS is Now in about 10% of their locations, has a true healthcare offering. Now. It’s, you know, obviously more limited than going to a hospital, but I think that’s where this probably leads. And I think this is maybe the future of care in pharmacy is small, private urgent care clinics growing and basically trying to drive customers into an ecosystem that’s more than just buying a prescription and some associated products.
00:17:09 Chris
Do you see the lack of the combination, you know, hurting CVS in the long run in terms of like, kind of weakening the moat, so to speak? Like, you know, do you think the probability or the risk that CVS fall to CVS pharmacies, pharmacy side of the business falls into kind of the same arena that Walgreens has fallen into. You know, they’ve hit tough times. Rite Aid went out of business. Walgreens is now private equity owned. Do you feel like that increases the risk here for cvs? What’s your take on that,.
00:17:37 Jack
I do think, I do think it increases the risk to the retail business primarily because of they don’t have the integration with a large benefits manager that can kind of steer pharmacy customers to the pharmacy. And I think that’s worked really well for them. And this is good, this is going to hurt that now they’re going to have to compete for the attention of all benefit managers and not have a captive one of their own.
00:18:01 Chris
Yeah. The interesting thing about this too is like CVS is pretty well run. Like the sales performance I looked up, sales performance of the pharmacy is still fairly strong. It’s been a really well run company for a long time. But yes, the endemic issues facing the pharmacy business, they’re going to have to face them on their own. Angela, what do you think here?
00:18:19 Angela
I agree with Jack. I think it’s definitely building, you know, you’ve done all this to sort of build this ecosystem, be meaningful to people in all ways. And that user experience piece of having reasons to come into a store or engage with a brand in general that isn’t around just a transaction of a purchase is where everybody’s leaning towards. So kind of separating that out is going to be a little tricky for them. Yeah. So I totally agree.
00:18:46 Chris
Yeah. And I do, I do think the one, the one nice thing about cvs, I think relative to Walgreens, I think. And Jack, your point about the minute clinic is dead on. You know, you know, we’ve talked, we’ve been talking about, I feel like we’ve been talking about minute clinics as a concept for not just minute clinics, but the broad concept for, you know, the last 10 or 15 years. And it still hasn’t taken off to the degree that has. I’m a big user of it personally. So I think, like to your point, I think we’ll continue to see the trend there. But like the CVS experience, well, relative to the Walgreens experience, at least in my purview of it is a very different experience. And so I think that gives CVS a little bit of a leg up to hopefully, you know, kind of withstand some of the competitive pressures and dynamics of the industry. All right, headline number three.
Headline number three is brought to you by Corso. Your stores are full of data, but are your teams acting on it? Corso turns retail data into personalized daily to dos that drive sales, reduce waste and improve execution. No fluff, just action. Help your managers focus on what matters most. Visit corso.com to see Intelligent Management in Motion. Headline number three. Ajo Delez USA is modernizing its in store technology, rolling out NCR’s Voix commerce platform across point of sale, self checkout, pharmacy and fuel operations. According to ChainStorage, the new POS technology is already live in 100 stores with installation continuing over the next several years. The move follows other recent tech moves, specifically the proprietary E commerce platform now running all five brands that completed in late 2025, a proprietary retail media platform and the merger of its digital, data and tech teams into one organization. Jack, I’m going to go back to you on this one. How much compassion do you feel for Ahold’s technology team right now as they undergo a POS overhaul? That’s my first question.
00:20:36 Jack
Hey, that is, that is actually the right question too. You know, having gone through tech stack upgrades at multiple retailers, this is a big lift. I mean you’re talking about, you know, over 2,000 stores, tens of thousands of POS terminals. But this, that, that’s the, that’s the part of the iceberg that’s above the surface of the water, below the surface of the water is integrating the back end right now. You know, I’m not an expert on Ahold Deli’s back end. That said, I imagine with their multiple brands and their, you know, their history that they have a variety of systems on the back end that they’re going.
00:21:23 Chris
To, my.
00:21:24 Jack
God, they’re going to have to sort of merge all of those into one back end and which is actually where the value is. But it’s also a lot of work and it’s not just to work for the tech team, it’s a work for the merchants, it’s a work for merchant ops team that has to, you know, relearn systems and has to help make sure all of the data migration gets done seamlessly. So sympathy at max level on this one. It’s a lot of work.
00:21:52 Chris
Yeah, right. I mean when you have that many banners that have existed for so long, you can only imagine the complication of this effort. And I always joke too, like the, the POS upgrade in the tech community is thought of as the, as the upgrade that gets you fired too, if you don’t do it correctly. Right. So Angela’s laughing. Jack’s laughing. Angela, what do you feel compassion too? And then my other question is, why is having a strong POS so important, Angela? And, and makes an upgrade of a POS so challenging for our audience?
00:22:18 Angela
So I have absolute sympathy, sympathy for them because I’ve done a few digital replatforms and it’s a multi year project, of course. And very challenging. And you’re right, it could be a career breaker, career maker. But coming from the POS and experience piece of it, you know, it’s really critical because I’ve worked with, you know, omnichannel brands, I might have been on a digital side, but from a customer experience side, if that POS system is clunky, you want to take in people’s email addresses as they’re at checkout, you want to ask them to donate like we did at Patagonia. We integrated, you know, that type of software at checkout. The. The minute you ask someone to do something other than pay and get out the door, if you are slowing them down or it gets clunky or you lost them and they’re like, it’s seconds on the clock, you know, you lose that engagement with that customer. And then more importantly, the data just, I’m, you know, I’m advocate for having clean data. So if you’re, if that’s messy, systems aren’t talking to each other, you’re losing things. It’s not integrated seamlessly or you can’t utilize the data. It’s. It’s incredibly challenging. And then just talk about the human side of it. Right. Like here you are with a customer checking out groceries, and if you haven’t learned that new system, you don’t feel confident in it. That just starts to, you know, there’s all the reasons that someone might not come back to the store again. Right. So,.
00:23:45 Chris
Yeah, 100%. And you’re bringing up, you’re bringing up good points too, is like the connections are not just across the banners of the physical stores. The connections are also across the digital platforms of all the banners, across all these different stores within this network of Aho Delez usa too, which is also super complicated. Jack, you wanted to add something?
00:24:02 Jack
Yeah, I think. And Angela touched on it there at the end of her comments around the operators themselves and their confidence. And, you know, I mentioned that, hey, it’s not just the tech team, it’s the merchants. This is a huge lift for operations as well and training all of their staff to use a new pos, you know, and that customer touch point, to Angela’s point, speed matters. And if you’re not confident, you’re not going to be fast. And it’ll be really interesting to see, you know, how quickly they’re able to roll this out and train all of those staff. But, I mean, the benefits are clear. But there’s a lot of risk and a lot of work ahead.
00:24:47 Chris
Right, Right. I mean, it Is that the other thing too to point out for the audience? It is the foundational technology for Omni channel retailing. I know that from my experience. I know that from. I had a chance to sit down with Walmart’s current CEO John Furner back at grocery shop in 2019 and he and I had a one on one and asked him what is the most essential component to good omnichannel retailing. He said, point of sale. So ding, ding, you know, ding, ding, ding, there it is, there’s the answer. But it’s really, really hard to do. Jack, the other thing you made me think about on the merchandising side, one of the things I ran into is like, you know, your point of sale can, can limit or expand the reach of your promotional and your pricing activity, which is hugely important when you start talking about grocery as well. So like, you know, the degree to which it can handle the complex promotions schemas that all these different brands are running is just absolutely critical, is it not?
00:25:38 Jack
It absolutely is. And as that’s actually one of the great things about the solution that they’ve chosen is it allows them to maintain a lot of local flexibility in terms of pricing promotions, how, how the product is presented to the customer and you know, as opposed to one of the newer upstart kind of cookie cutter, I don’t want to call them cookie cutter, but, but less, less design for big multi unit, multi brand retailers. And the NCR solution will enable them to program locally, keep their loyalty programs separate, keep their pricing and promotion engines, you know, tailored to what that those customers are used to seeing and absent that this would be an even bigger challenge.
00:26:36 Chris
Yeah, that’s a really great point too, Jack, and it’s great to have you on too from the convenience store perspective too, because I actually had the chance to interview NCR Voyex at NAX last month, you know, and the interesting thing about them, which is why they feel like the right partner. And I always, people always ask me like what technology platform you recommend. And I always say I will never recommend a platform because every retailer is different, every solution has different advantages and disadvantages. But when I think about it in terms of what the challenge is in front of Ahold right now, like it’s very complex and NCR Voix is rooted in the convenience store industry for the most part. So like there’s elements to this story that I didn’t even talk about. Like they’re able to connect, you know, your fuel experience, you know, to your in store point of sale, to your digital point of sale, all those things matter.
And so you know, when you have a partner that has the flexibility of to your point, Jack, handling this at a local level across many disparate types of operations, you know, kudos to ahold for trying it and you know, I hope it works. And it probably at the end of the day, I mean the, the Amazon shopping, you know, story that we led the show with is huge. But from a day to day operational impact on the business, this is way, way up there relative to other headlines that we talk about on a regular basis. All right, headline number four, we’re cooking with gas. Headline number four is brought to you by Ocampo Capital. Ocampo Capital is a venture capital firm founded by retail executives with the aim of helping early stage consumer businesses succeed through investment and operational support. You can learn more@ocampo capital.com headline number four, Disney ran its first ever. Here it go.
Here I go again. Tick Tock Shop Super Brand Day. TikTok Shop is the hardest thing I say on this podcast every single week, bringing Disney Store and more than 20 brands together for a week long holiday shopping event. According to Marketing Dive, the event featured products from Disney’s store plus brands including Old Navy, Crocs, Touchland and Colourpop along with items exclusive to tickets Tock Shop for a limited time. The event just concluded. It ran November 4th through the 10th and kicked off with a Disney store TikTok Live. Two exclusives. One that I’m ashamed to say I did not get my hands on. A Darth on a Hearth collectible and a Lounge Fly Holiday mini backpack. Both debuted on the Disney Tick Tock Shop store before even reaching disney store.com on November 11th. Angela, this one is tailor made for you. You’ve lived on the brand side of digital. Disney let TikTok get products before its own website did. Should more brands be doing this or is this giving a platform your exclusives a dangerous precedent? Where do you come down on that one?
00:29:16 Angela
Yeah, you know, I first have to say it’s a pretty brilliant marketing play. You know, to be able as a licensee to see all that product in one place and have a buzzworthy event like that’s something that very few brands can do. It’s an acquisition play really. Right. You know, but Disney can do this for other brands. I would say it could be really challenging, you know, from a channel perspective that actually would erode your credibility from your own and operated store site perspective. I’ve worked for a lot of omnichannel brands and it’s really important that you train your customers. If they come to this brand directly, they’re going to get the best visibility, the biggest access to that brand you want to be like. When I think about the brands I work for, Patagonia, Levi, those dot com, especially at Levi, I was only 8% of the global business and I’m competing against something like, you know, their Macy’s accounts, these huge other brands. And it used to be that the exclusive went to Macy’s or it went to some prestigious retail partner that they had a wholesale partner and I had to fight for. Now, if you really want Levi.com to be the destination, you have a start here. Now, it was only two days, so it could be like a preview and then it’s going to be on Disney stores. But for Disney, I think it’s a really smart play and it would take a long time before we damage them.
00:30:37 Chris
So Disney’s kind of a different here because they have a retail presence, but they’re more. They’re more like the licensee, the brand in this conversation. Jack, what do you think?
00:30:44 Jack
So, you know, I agree with Angela, for Disney, this is a really, really smart play. And look, you mentioned you missed out on the Darth on the heart. Yeah. Here’s the good news. It launched this morning on the Disney Store. So you still can go get it. Right. And briefly. And it did sell out. It was selling well, you know, above asking price, you know, above list price on ebay, you know, shortly after it sold out. But it’s back on, you know, Disney store for 29.99. So you can go get it. I checked this morning. It was. Because I.
00:31:16 Chris
Was.
00:31:17 Jack
I did. I was.
00:31:18 Chris
That’s great.
00:31:19 Jack
I was really curious to see how this would play out.
00:31:22 Chris
Right.
00:31:23 Jack
And so I went and checked it and it was listed this morning. Now it may sell out there, too. What I think’s brilliant about this is the limited time. Right. Drive some excitement, a little bit of scarcity. You felt, you know, this fomo, right. And now. But now, hey, we broaden to more units available on our own proprietary channel. And now that we’ve created the demand, we can fulfill it. So I think it’s a really smart move by Disney here.
00:31:50 Chris
By Disney. Okay. Yes. That’s the key point here. The key point here is it seems like we all agree that, you know, pretty good, decent move for Disney. But Jack, Jack and I want to put your feet to the fire a little bit. True Omni talk style here. I want to go deep on this one. A little Bit because there’s a part of me that thinks it is a dangerous precedent. And so I’m going to ask the question, like, would a retailer particularly like you. Can you. Can we just pick one out of a hat? We could say Ulta, Sephora, whatever. What a retailer ever. Jack, I’ll go to you first on this. Would a retailer ever do something similar like this on Amazon?
00:32:22 Jack
You know, that’s, that’s a loaded question at ever. I suspect not. And I think the primary reason is because of the fulfillment, fulfillment capabilities that Amazon has. Right. And. And you don’t. Whereas TikTok is, you know, they, well, they’re actually becoming a big retailer, but to truly become a, A, you know, an omnichannel retailer that you’re scared of, they’d have to build out the infrastructure to deliver the products. Right. And they could, they could do that through partnerships. But today TikTok feels very different than Amazon and so I. Would anyone ever do it on Amazon? It’s a good question. You know, you think about prime days and the, and the. Trying to drive some, some.
00:33:13 Chris
Right.
00:33:14 Jack
Some awareness during those. So I think a little bit, yes. But again, it’s this limited time functionality that I think is important versus launch there first permanently and then follow up with your own site. Feels like a very dangerous strategy for most retailers.
00:33:32 Chris
Right, right. Okay. Angela. Yeah. Just does me asking you that question add any, any new thoughts into your head as we’re discussing this headline?
00:33:39 Angela
Yeah. I think the Amazon example, to Jack’s point, would be something that’s probably a little less likely. A partnership with another maybe prestigious brand. You think about the approach, how maybe people do collaborations, like you can buy this product limited with this other person, it might elevate your customer database or the customers that come to you. But TikTok shop is social shopping, which is a completely different lane. Right. And so.
00:34:04 Chris
I know, right. That’s the difference.
00:34:06 Angela
The Ultas, I could see ELF cosmetics doing something like this. They have a huge social presence. They’re always been a brand winning at space. So I could actually see them doing it again, limited, and then offering it within their own channels like Disney did. But if you were to do only in that channel and not offering your own brand, I think that would be a mistake.
00:34:24 Chris
Yeah, yeah. So it’s really fascinating. Like we have this conception of what TikTok is now, but our job is to talk about where the future is going. Right. And so like the one concern that I have, because I do think, I think Ulta and Sephora will take they’ll take a bite of this Apple here very soon, you know, or some company like them, you know, I’m not going to necessarily say them, but some company like them because, like, the reason I think it’s dangerous. All of retail is essentially in cahoots now that they are unknowingly making TikTok potentially the most powerful retail marketplace in the U.S. because if you think about it, TikTok and Angela, you hit it right on the head. It’s the only marketplace that can connect social to commerce. And also potentially in the long run, going back to the, some of the threads we talked about in the first headline, potentially win the search box as well, because you can search within TikTok and that’s, that’s how I found this experience, for example. So, like, that’s a really powerful position for TikTok to be in. So I think the retailers need to tread a little more carefully here in terms of what power they’re giving to them. Angela, you’re shaking your head.
00:35:29 Angela
Yeah, yeah, I absolutely agree. I think there’s, you know, when there’s something new emerging, there’s a lot of people that just want to jump on the next shiny thing. But you really have to be strategic about it. You have to understand why you’re doing it, who you’re going after, what your end game is, and when things go sideways, what’s your exit strategy so you can save face if need be. Right? So I think it is something that you couldn’t just jump into without having all those pillars lined up.
00:35:53 Jack
TikTok is already a big retailer. Right.
00:35:56 Chris
It is.
00:35:57 Jack
Projected over 23 billion in sales in the US alone this year, up almost 50%.
00:36:04 Chris
Right.
00:36:06 Jack
They’re not going away. And so I, I think it’s smart for some of these brands to, to, you know, to, to join forces with them and use them as the great marketing engine they are. They’re all about discovery and the, how, you know, getting these influencers and content creators behind your product is a, is a great way to market again. The key for me is how do you, how do you use them for these exclusive moments, these brief periods? Get the demand out there, but drive that demand to your proprietary channel.
00:36:47 Chris
Right? That’s a really good, that’s a really good qualification because at the end of the day, it’s about controlling the relationship with the customer. And you might. You’re right, Jack, I think it’s a good point. Like you might be willing to cede some of that control to the customer at the key seasonal moments that matter to you from a merchandising standpoint. All right, headline number five. Headline number five is brought to you by Manhattan Associates. Manhattan Associates is the global leader in cloud native and AI empowered supply chain commerce solutions. Manhattan has spent more than three decades helping the world’s leading brands manage their warehouses, transportation, inventory, and fulfillment operations to efficiently and effectively deliver on their promise to their end customers. For more details, visit http://www.manh.com.
All right, last headline of today. Doordash is once again pitching itself as the mall in your pocket, but this time for the holidays, replete with Christmas tree delivery and even Black Friday deals. According to DoorDash, Macse’s Anthropologie, Best Buy, Ulta Beauty and skims are now on the platform. And Black Friday deals run 1123-1130. So November 23rd to November 30th, with up to 50% off at Ulta and up to 40% off at Lowe’s. It is also promoting Christmas trees from November 15 to December 7, both real and faux trees, I might add, from Michael’s, Kohl’s, Home Depot, Ace Hardware, and Lowe’s, again with 20 off orders of $60 or more that include a tree with up to 20 off. Using code litmus, L I T M A S. I love that code. I’m a big promo code guy. Angela, Does DoorDash’s holiday 2026 plans mark the day, the official day in which Doordash moved from a third party delivery service into a bona fide and formidable retailer?
00:38:36 Angela
You know, I think the. The lines are starting to blur, but actually, I don’t think so.
00:38:41 Chris
I don’t think so. Okay. All right.
00:38:44 Angela
They’re marketing holiday deals, shopping moments, effortless shopping, but it’s not a real retail experience.
00:38:52 Chris
Okay. I love the.
00:38:53 Angela
Christmas tree idea because in reading the article, they said, you know, the fun part is picking the tree in that experience, but we can deliver it for you. Okay, well, stop right there. Like, that’s what people do. Think about pumpkin picking. Like it becomes a family event to go pick your live tree. If you’re not in the live trees, then absolutely. So I think that there is, like I said, they’re tapping into it. They’re doing the branding, they’re doing, you know, getting things to you quickly is still efficiency and getting things that you might not have time to go shop yourself, but being a retailer, I still think they have a ways to go.
00:39:28 Chris
Wow. Okay, Jack, agree or disagree with Angela,.
00:39:31 Jack
They have a ways to go for sure. But I really do think this is a Move to position them more as a true retailer. Retail is a distribution business and they are right now positioned as the last mile distributor of choice for a lot of customers. Right. And what this does is further, you know, solidify their relationship with the customer. Right. To try and make them where do I search for products. And stitching the middle together is still going to be a challenge for Door dash. And they’ve got that last mile and then now they’re trying to dabble in and kind of trying to generate the demand and own the relationship with the customer. And I think this is a smart move. And in particular this time of year, you know, frankly, I’m surprised they haven’t had kind of a Black Friday approach before.
00:40:26 Chris
I know, right? It’s like why haven’t, why hasn’t this happened before? Right? I thought the same thing.
00:40:30 Jack
Yeah. If you’re going to be the mall in your pocket, right. You need to have mall like deals. They’ve got partnerships with some great brands that you rattled off before. And this just seems to make sense, like drive the demand to doordash, not to the retailer. I, I think at this time of year in particular, it’s super smart because their big, big advantage over traditional e commerce is the last minute Christmas shopper. Right. You go those last two or three, four days before Christmas, you as a shopper, you’re really worried about purchasing, you know, in traditional e commerce. But doordash can get you stuff on Christmas day, right. I mean now granted most of the retailers they partner with would be closed on Christmas day, but Christmas Eve the day before, they will be able to go source those products for you and bring them, bring you those last minute gift needs for, you know, people that sometimes get behind on their shopping, like me.
00:41:29 Chris
Yeah, the emergency shopping angle is, is really key here, Jack. And you know, to your point too, like, I think the other reason they haven’t done this, they haven’t had the scale, they haven’t had, they haven’t had the footprint in the malls that they’ve built over the course of the last year. Particularly because we’ve talked about it a lot on this show. Yeah, No, I think the Dash pass elements interesting here. I think the returns element is interesting here too, particularly as well. The crazy thing to me is like, you know, doordash, when it came out to me it was like, it was like the Southwest Airlines of restaurant delivery. It was like I didn’t care who delivered it to me. I just wanted to get to my door and, and now they’re offering, offering Black Friday deals on mall based retailers. That’s wild to me that we have gone through that historical progression in just a matter of what, like, I don’t know, 10 years or so, give or take. So it’s wild to think they got to the, they got to that point. And then the other point I’d make too is the absolute smarts of the leadership team at DoorDash.
You just have to give them credit for being able to pull off that progression because that’s not easy to do, the fact that we’re even talking about this. But Angela, I’m going to put you on the spot later with my Lightning Round question because I think, I think you see that I, I, I, I personally think this is, I think they are trying to become a retailer. So this to me signals the watershed moment of, hey, we are going to be a retailer, we’re going to go after this business and we’re going to be there, particularly in those seasonal periods like Jack mentioned, where you potentially want to go with us. But I’m going to put your feet to the fire in the Lightning Round around holiday shopping. So I can’t wait to see, see how you answer my upcoming question on that. Let’s go to the Lightning round. Today’s Lightning Round is brought to you with the help and support of Smart Scout. Smart Scout is Amazon Shop and TikTok Shop Intelligence. Most tools show you your own account. Smart Scout shows you the market, brand, revenue, category, share and who really owns it. Visit smartscout.com Omni Talk all right, Angela, here it is. We’ll continue this conversation. If you could only pick one to do all of your holiday shopping this year. Texting Alexa for shopping. Like we talked about at the outset, Tick tock shop or DoorDash. Which one are you going with?
00:43:37 Angela
I’m gonna have to go with Alexa if I have to pick one. Okay. Because I’m already on Amazon. I’m already there. I already buy holiday gifts through Amazon, especially because a lot of my family’s on the other side of the country and then, but I would say we should all test out Tick Tock Shop. If you haven’t bought a Tick Tock Shop, you should absolutely try it. It’s a very unique experience. But I’m gonna stick with Alexa.
00:43:59 Chris
Okay. All right. Okay, Jack, I’m gonna ask you which one would you, which way would you go with this?
00:44:03 Jack
I might surprise you, but, and Angela sort of alluded to it at the end there, but I would go with the Tick Tock Shop. And let me Tell you why it’s about the discovery. Right. I think TikTok shop introduces products that I wouldn’t have thought to search for. And I do think that, you know, shopping with Alexa is very powerful. The AI tools there are incredible, and I’m a big Amazon customer myself. But when I want to, you know, find something that I didn’t even think to look for, I will tell you that social media has brought me more gift ideas for my friends and family than I could ever discover just searching on my own.
00:44:43 Chris
Yeah, yeah. And the other point, too is Alexa is. Alexa is potentially limited in the brands that you have access to. Right. Because not all those brands sell like some of the ones we just mentioned on Door Dash don’t sell on Amazon, but they probably have a presence on TikTok and Door Dash too. So. Yeah. Wow, this is. It’s really interesting to hear both of you, like, kind of position TikTok shop in the way that you’re positioning, given your experience. All right, next one. Jack, since DoorDash will now deliver your Christmas tree, real or faux, what’s the earliest acceptable date for people to put a tree up in their house?
00:45:17 Jack
Well, okay, so I’m gonna rat out my mom. She put hers up before Halloween inside the house.
00:45:25 Chris
Oh, my God. Before Halloween?
00:45:27 Jack
Yeah, but that was because she was planning for some travel coming up and didn’t want to be pushing it late at the end day the of. Of the season. You know, I personally think you have to get past Halloween. We, We. We put up our outdoor lights already. So I will confess, but I will say we don’t turn them on until Thanksgiving weekend. But I like to get them up early.
00:45:49 Chris
Yeah, well, yeah, I mean, lights is. Lights is weather dependent too, but yeah, I. Yeah, man, after Halloween. I don’t know if I could go with that one. I’m kind of an after Thanksgiving guy. All right, Angela, next one. With Black Friday just two weeks away, Patagonia famously ran a Don’t buy this jacket ad on Black Friday. Is that the greatest anti marketing marketing campaign of all time or is there a better one in your mind?
00:46:13 Angela
I think it’s the greatest. I know biased because I work for the brand, but let’s think about it. That ad ran in print in 2011. Fifteen years later, we’re still talking about it. And when I worked for digital, we had to create a landing page because there was still so much SEO traffic. Traffic for don’t buy this jacket 50. Seriously, when I started four or five.
00:46:34 Chris
Years ago,.
00:46:35 Angela
I had.
00:46:35 Chris
To really.
00:46:36 Angela
Build a landing page. Because I was like, where’s all this traffic going? Like, it’s going to some old. Like, yeah, New York Times. Like, are you crazy? That’s our traffic. Like, literally, to this day, it ranks in the top 20 search sometimes where people are still searching for that and they want to know about this. They want to read about it. It is still has legs, so I don’t think anything can match that.
00:46:58 Chris
Yeah, I don’t think so. I did a search yesterday, too, because I knew I was gonna ask you this question. I was like, yeah, that’s still the best one. 100. It is 100. All right, Jack, last one. With Thanksgiving also two weeks away because, you know, it coincides with Black Friday, what’s the most overrated side dish on the average Thanksgiving table?
00:47:17 Jack
Oh, wow. The most overrated side dish for me, personally, is cranberry sauce. Sauce. And it’s just because I’m not a huge fan of cranberry sauce. But give me as the most important is a traditional Southern dressing made with cornbread.
00:47:33 Chris
Okay, okay, I can go with that. But cranberries, I can’t get on board with. Angela, what’s your answer here?
00:47:38 Angela
I actually have the opposite. I cannot stand stuffing and my grandfather’s cranberries. I, I will turn anybody into a cranberry fan if I can make my grandfather’s from scratch cranberry sauce. So I literally have the Polaroids.
00:47:56 Chris
Yeah, right. I, I, my husband, we would all agree that Thanksgiving is the most polarizing meal that we all eat together every year. Like, somebody loves or hates some element of every dish, you know? Like, it’s just the way it works.
00:48:08 Angela
So.
00:48:08 Chris
All right, awesome. Well, today’s podcast was produced with the help and support of Ellis Sirior. Happy birthday today to Calista Flockhart, Scoot McNary, and to a man so well known, he need only go by three letters. And of course, I’m talking about Leo, and you know, which Leo I of which I speak. And remember, if you can only read or listen to one retail blog in the business, make it Omni Talk. Our Fast Five podcast is the quickest, fastest rundown of all the week’s top news. And our daily newsletter, the Retail Daily Minute, tells you all you need to know each day to stay on top of your game as a retail executive. And also regularly features special content that is exclusive to us and that we all take a ton of pride in doing just for you. Thanks, as always for listening in. Please remember to like and leave us a review wherever you happen to listen to your podcast or on YouTube. You can follow us today by simply going to YouTube.com Omni Talk Retail Jack, if people want to get in touch with you after listening to this, what’s the best way for them to do that?
00:49:02 Jack
I think the most straightforward way is LinkedIn. I’m Jack Stout. You know, make sure you get the one that’s a fairly common name, but make sure you get the one that has 7:11 and Peter Co Chief Merchant in the background.
00:49:14 Chris
Yeah, good call. Good call. Yeah. And you’re very responsive on LinkedIn too, Angela, what’s the best way for you?
00:49:18 Angela
I’m on LinkedIn too. Angela Clark slash Mubarak. You can find me from Patagonia. I’m very active on LinkedIn as well.
00:49:27 Chris
Yeah, and you got an initial in your LinkedIn too, right, Angela?
00:49:29 Angela
Yeah, I. There’s a lot of Angela Clark said, so I was advised to put a D in there, but then I just use my married name too, so I have both of those. And then my website, Eclipse Advisory Group, if anyone’s looking for consulting or help with their business.
00:49:47 Chris
Awesome. Awesome. Well, thank you both again. That was so much fun. I think we just had great banter, great vibe here this whole time. So really appreciate you both spending time with us and getting to introduce you to our Omni Talk audience. I’m guessing they felt the same way. So until next week, on behalf of all of us at Omni Talk Retail, as always, be careful out there.
Omni Talk® is the retail blog for retailers, written by retailers. Chris Walton founded Omni Talk® in 2017 and have quickly turned it into one of the fastest growing blogs in retail.